by milkpaint » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:37 pm
have been in AA for under a year, go to meetings regularly and have met many genuine and supportive people along the way. As much as there is to gain from these meetings, there is one factor that is not a positive. AA is supposed to feel like a safe, caring environment. That said, it is extremely undermining when some of the men at these meetings clearly interested in more; even when the interest is one sided. Newer to sobriety, (and I am told this is common) I feel vulnerable in my efforts to take a new direction. It takes courage and strength to show up to a group of strangers. A number of men seem to look for the newer and inexperienced members and are quick to impart all kinds of "advice" early in the game. After a few minutes talking to me, for example, they have found creative ways to get my contact information, sent me email, or press me for details about my life. One guy has said on two occasions (in so many words) that I must not have had much of a problem judging by the way I look. If it sounds like a compliment, it didn't FEEL like one. It felt wrong for a lot of reasons... here's one: we alcoholics are always looking for ways to see ourselves as not as bad as all the "real" alcoholics, and that WE probably don't have a true problem. Not a good mindset for the newly sober.
Here's the kind of conversation I've had more than once. The guy will start off talking and soon into the conversation asks,
"Where do you live?"
"Oh, nearby," I say.
"WHERE though?"
"About 10 minutes from here," I say and look away.
"Yeah, but what town - where do you live?!" Etc, etc."
Another subtle message was sent with a man saying the "innocently,"
"yeah, I know where A L L the women's-only meetings are, heh heh heh."
I have a friendly (but NOT AT ALL flirtatous) personality which seems to have translated into a problem in meetings. I am always told by members I "should" hang out after meetings to get to know people, I "should" come with this group or that to such-and-such a meeting. There's a lot of encouragement, and usually with good intention, to be open minded and willing to buy into the program if we are going to succeed at sobriety. When a member's motives are questonalble, it undermines everything.
I suspect some readers will think I am either conceited, paranoid, cold or am just reading into things. I am not saying poor me, and I am not saying that I am some tragic victim. I am none of those and feel lucky for this program which has saved so many lives. It is essential, though, that this feel like a safe place, not one that makes women feel closed off or suspicious about some members. If women are going to feel comfortable come to co-ed meetings (my preference because I like a variety of perspectives and the convenience of more meetings available) we have to feel valued and not objectified. Women's meetings are obviously an alternative if we can't find a comfortable co-ed meeting.
For men, I would like to add that if a woman is friendly by nature (friendly to everyone, not only to you), that is not synonymous with her being INTERESTED in you. If she's interested, you WILL KNOW and won't have to sneak subtle comments into conversation with her. When she's new, treat a woman as you would any male newcomer, or if you get to know her well, treat her as a sister. She is a person, not an object. If this were your daughter, how would you feel if her sobriety was in jeopardy because she felt uncomfortable at meetings? It is not ok to pray upon women who are at meetings to get well - to save their lives!
Please help make this a better program. The completely inappropriate concept of the "13th step" should never happen.
have been in AA for under a year, go to meetings regularly and have met many genuine and supportive people along the way. As much as there is to gain from these meetings, there is one factor that is not a positive. AA is supposed to feel like a safe, caring environment. That said, it is extremely undermining when some of the men at these meetings clearly interested in more; even when the interest is one sided. Newer to sobriety, (and I am told this is common) I feel vulnerable in my efforts to take a new direction. It takes courage and strength to show up to a group of strangers. A number of men seem to look for the newer and inexperienced members and are quick to impart all kinds of "advice" early in the game. After a few minutes talking to me, for example, they have found creative ways to get my contact information, sent me email, or press me for details about my life. One guy has said on two occasions (in so many words) that I must not have had much of a problem judging by the way I look. If it sounds like a compliment, it didn't FEEL like one. It felt wrong for a lot of reasons... here's one: we alcoholics are always looking for ways to see ourselves as not as bad as all the "real" alcoholics, and that WE probably don't have a true problem. Not a good mindset for the newly sober.
Here's the kind of conversation I've had more than once. The guy will start off talking and soon into the conversation asks,
"Where do you live?"
"Oh, nearby," I say.
"WHERE though?"
"About 10 minutes from here," I say and look away.
"Yeah, but what town - where do you live?!" Etc, etc."
Another subtle message was sent with a man saying the "innocently,"
"yeah, I know where A L L the women's-only meetings are, heh heh heh."
I have a friendly (but NOT AT ALL flirtatous) personality which seems to have translated into a problem in meetings. I am always told by members I "should" hang out after meetings to get to know people, I "should" come with this group or that to such-and-such a meeting. There's a lot of encouragement, and usually with good intention, to be open minded and willing to buy into the program if we are going to succeed at sobriety. When a member's motives are questonalble, it undermines everything.
I suspect some readers will think I am either conceited, paranoid, cold or am just reading into things. I am not saying poor me, and I am not saying that I am some tragic victim. I am none of those and feel lucky for this program which has saved so many lives. It is essential, though, that this feel like a safe place, not one that makes women feel closed off or suspicious about some members. If women are going to feel comfortable come to co-ed meetings (my preference because I like a variety of perspectives and the convenience of more meetings available) we have to feel valued and not objectified. Women's meetings are obviously an alternative if we can't find a comfortable co-ed meeting.
For men, I would like to add that if a woman is friendly by nature (friendly to everyone, not only to you), that is not synonymous with her being INTERESTED in you. If she's interested, you WILL KNOW and won't have to sneak subtle comments into conversation with her. When she's new, treat a woman as you would any male newcomer, or if you get to know her well, treat her as a sister. She is a person, not an object. If this were your daughter, how would you feel if her sobriety was in jeopardy because she felt uncomfortable at meetings? It is not ok to pray upon women who are at meetings to get well - to save their lives!
Please help make this a better program. The completely inappropriate concept of the "13th step" should never happen.